A Lager Boy In A Sea of Hobgoblins | Stalin: Rise to Power (Part 1)

0:00History fans, my Christmas crackers are back for 2026 with an all new awful jokes and a brand new game. Why not really put the cat amongst the pigeons this year with some Finn Taylor. Put the aunt in the bin. Put the what? Put the aunt in the bin. Put your aunt in the bin. Christmas crackers. Put your aunt in a foul mood. But when is she not? Yes, to be honest, uppity bitch. Oh, my aunt's really good natured said no one ever how's this for a fad diet my aunt uh for two months just ate raw broccoli just smashed through it that's it yeah crunching away crunching broccoli we're literally doing that that's good christmas crackers are on sale now retard proof. Charlie reminded me to say that, actually.

0:46We've got more stock this year. In terms of jokes, now this was too late for the deadline for this, but how's this for a joke? This is Rob Moriarty's joke, right? It's brilliant. I'm on the paleo diet. I paleoed a cat period of shit in my mouth. Shout out, Rob. One of the most twisted minds on the comedy circuit. You should follow him on Instagram, but you can't because Instagram's been banned. He's been banned. For jokes like that. But anyway, that's the kind of stuff you want around the Christmas table. Buy the comedy crackers. Link's here. My wife's put her heart and soul into this. Look at how nice that box is. God bless her. He's lovely. God bless her. She needs this. So buy some crackers

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2:00is what closes deals. You may have the best product, but buyers won't sign without proof that your product is secure, especially if it has AI. Vanta gets you compliant fast with SOC 2, ISO 27001, and more, and keeps you secure with continuous monitoring. Hyperbound, a YC-backed startup, used Vanta to unlock the Fortune 100 in under a year. Snowfire got audit ready in a month and closed a multi-million dollar deal. Trust matters. Get started at Vanta.com. Welcome back to FinVersus History. I'm joined by Horatio Gould. Hello. And it's one of the big five the big one it's the the big one for me i think it's sort of the thinking man's hitler uh i take issue with that statement out the gate yes you all the stupid man stalin as i call it the thick lesbian uh woke

2:57tards hitler um today we're talking about stalin i'm nervous man it's when i saw this in the diary this is a big fixture this is north london derby you circle this you where you're watching that you clear the schedule you just want to do it right but yeah it's like the big five in hunting you have you know leopards lions elephants buffalo yeah this is in that territory for me totally if you're doing dictators you're in the big five i'd almost say that for dictators it's's like genders. Until about the 70s, there were two genders. Hitler and Stalin. Yes. So the original. The original two genders. Right. Are you Hitler or are you Stalin? Yeah. That's why this podcast works. Hitler, Stalin. But then, you know, then the universities got hold of the idea.

3:40And suddenly there's, oh, I'm actually, I'm a Gaddafi. I'm an Indian. I'm a Saddam Hussein. I'm a Pol Pot. I'm a Kim Jong-un. It's's like can we just get back to the two genital hitler and starlin the two genders you know lsd infiltrate the universities and everything fractured and prismed off exactly there's a million different there's a hundred dictators but really there are two dictators hitler and starlin yeah now some of us feed quiz are you hitler or starlin yeah exactly and now it's like i'm a i'm a gaddafi trapped inside the body of you hitler or stalin yeah exactly and now it's like a bagel or a donut i'm a goddaffy trapped inside the body of a hitler this is too confusing arguably that's

4:10true actually for me actually you know i might present as a hitler but really i'm a goddaffy right you know the repressed you know you're a press goddaffy it's the stalin is less on the surface than hitler i think yeah but i think you will agree you have a newfound respect for stalin as a man who slagged him off yeah yeah in your in my book which is i feel bad that i um uh we didn't do stalin before i wrote the book because i now love the guy uh he's much i did stalin at school right and uh he's much more of a laugh than i remember being taught right now obviously that's because our institution's been ideologically captured they can't teach kids a good time exactly you know they have to uh lie yeah they have to defame

4:59a great man funny guy without doubt my favorite communist yes without doubt yes i mean that's not a high bar to clear because you don't like any communist i think lenin and trotsky are pricks and then nowadays it's just fucking annoying people who i'd love to trotsky personally right um but stalin i didn't realize how much of a he's a guy's guy he is a guy's guy you know he's like a big bear and when you're talking about communism uh i think it's only actually recently when the soviet archives got opened that people realized that he was actually a true believer because he kept all that stuff he sort of he kind of minimized himself in the story yeah in a way right yeah compared to hitler and obviously hitler when hitler comes to power germany is a much more modern country than when stalin takes power from russia so there's news

5:49reels a bit of a classier figure than hitler i'd say potentially it's a bit more restrained you know he's got a drier sense of humor would you not say do you know what i mean it's not as bombastic as a gaddafi no but there's a there's a you just have to peel away some of the surface and then you get some of the funny stuff. Sorry, I'm saying he's more sophisticated when you're wearing that hat. It's quite different. Yeah, if you're listening, we are wearing, you know, what Stalin, Stalin did a lot for the modern day lesbian in midlife. Yes. Cause would not be cause without Stalin. Stalin, the long road to cause, to boxy fits for weedy thin men and lesbians. Well, yes. I mean, me, as soon as I walk into a shop like Cos and I see a lesbian, it's a race.

6:33To either, or same with the Doc Martin shop. Size 11 Doc Martin boots. Fucking get off! Fuck off, you duck! There's mine! Yeah, it's a race to the blouse between um skinny gangly men and big fucking we don't hang out but we dress the same it does a tough tension to gangly soy boys and lesbian midlife broadcasters yes are wearing the same fits yes but starling men and strong lesbians yeah exactly they do um and yeah stalin's a fun guy which i didn't know at school yeah but also there's an argument he's the most um probably most important actor of the 20th century yes for sure and i would say that if he if he had more to do with the russian revolution you could make that claim a bit stronger because but to be around for the russian revolution then

7:22to basically defeat hitler minute silence yeah then uh to essentially start the cold war define he defined even though he wasn't the key player in the revolution he defined what the soviet union was but also what's funny is that you know how you know he's the first guy to properly try communism yes and you know how when people that's tough well it is the first one he had to go yeah now you know how people say our communism never be properly been tried? I mean, some of us argue fascism's never been properly tried. All right. That was Hitlerism. That's not fascism. Yeah. Don't let the idea go the way of Hitler. Yes. Anyway, it'd be interesting to know, interesting to a parallel universe where it's not Stalin,

8:03it's someone else. Right. And how communism would have played out people davis or someone maybe it's maybe it's ed davy you know maybe it's ed davy yeah maybe ed davy communism would be different right we don't know we don't know it might be the exact same but the whole you know it could be exactly the same but maybe more bungee jumping and stuff like that yeah more tiktoks playing fif jumping and stuff like that. Yeah, more TikToks. Playing FIFA and stuff. The Lib Dem terror. But it's interesting to know how communism would be thought of if Stalin hadn't got hold of it. And it's a very personal... How Stalin defines the exact nature of it. Well, the big debate, as someone who was in communist cells at university,

8:43which is kind of an interesting perspective, because I sort of hung out there, but I did disagree with most of the things people said, where I just wanted exciting ideas for the future. You just wanted to think of someone who watched boring films. That's what you wanted to do. That's why we go to communist sock. But then on my first day of communist sock, someone did say they didn't believe in prisons. And I was like, right, well, this is a tough start. The key narrative for British communists at university so they didn't believe in prisons and i was like right well this is a this is a tough start yeah kind of the key narrative for for british communists at university is that what would have been uh if lenin lenin was a great guy if if only lenin had become the communist leader it

9:16would have all been different and stalin sort of captured it with it sort of an evil even though he did do a lot of good he took uh soviet union from peasant society to space age yeah which is very problematic thing to say but yeah lenin also invented the gulags then it was unbelievably ruthless and brutal no matter who would have been elected king of russia supreme leader of russia it would have been bloodbath because it's russia and it's never not been an absolute clusterfuck this is why it it's my favourite history Russia is because it's just consistently horrific and bleak from start to finish. Well from our perspective from their perspective this is the golden age of pig and shit. Absolute pig and shit

9:53alright. You know for us in the West we say there's no greater pleasure in life than watching your children grow up. In Russia there's no greater pleasure than watching them all die in infancy. You know they send the congratulations card after a miscarriage. Yeah it's character building. But it's very character building to make a good all die in infancy. You know? You know, they send the congratulations card after his miscarriage. Yeah. It's character building. Yeah. But it's very character building to make a good Russian kid. They die after six months. Brilliant. Character building. They will be a robust defender of the Russian nation. I've had a stillbirth. Congratulations. Listener, this episode of Finn vs History

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12:38Free shipping, free returns, no subscription required. Get started today at stitchFix.com. That's StitchFix.com. So you got a quote from Dostoevsky, your worst sin is that you have destroyed and betrayed yourself for nothing. Yeah. Come on, this is the kind of stuff. This is Russian grind set. Yeah. So, start of an epic series, you know, trembling prostate stuff. But in a different way, the British dad, this is not as, this is not the same retreat of the British dad, maybe. Maybe this is more of the North London British dad. I don't know. This is a slightly different shed. Yeah, it is. It's more of a hobo. Yeah, there's not like, it's a fucking wigwam in the garden. Yeah, there's allotments. It's not sort of uh drinking champers out the back of the land rover no it's an industrial estate right yeah it's a warehouse space an industrial estate so

13:54there's a sort of shed but they can't afford a shed so yeah exactly yeah no so uh stalin is obviously uh he's not russian he is georgian similar to hitler being austrian not german yes napoleon being cors, not German. Yes. Napoleon being Corsican, not French. Yes, there is an outsider element to all these great figures. He is born on the 18th of December, 1878, in Georgia, the birthplace of wine. And it's also, I mean, what's going on in Georgia? Well, I'm asking you as the scholar and the racist, what are you doing? I'm saying, I'm trying to as the, as the kind of the scholar and the racist, what are you doing? I'm saying just, I'm trying to get for my racism. Yeah. Cause you can't be cerebral about it.

14:29You got to go instinctual, right? Okay. So what's coming for me, you know, in Ratatouille where he's trying the cheese and the grapes, this is what I'm getting. I'm getting guys crossing their arms and doing this. Yeah. Right. I think that's more Ukrainian, but yeah. Okay. Um, and then I'm getting sort of i'll tell you what i'm getting gone their fate the faces yeah folded in you know lips are over the noses um uh so i'm all and in terms of like how it's sounding i'll be honest i'm getting a lot of borat yes i'm getting a lot my borat radar look at that georgian old man i'm getting a lot of Borat I'm getting a lot my Borat radar look at that Georgian old man I'm getting a lot of that it's you know

15:09it's where Borat meets Turkey they have great old people Georgia that's what an old person should look like I can't imagine a young Georgian I'll be honest well one of my dad's ex-girlfriends was Georgian of course shout out Irina great woman she did try to kill him with a knife but he did deserve it well that was an anniversary yeah wasn't it she might have stolen his car as well but um she's a great woman and look if you can't stand the heat then get out the game alright your dad is doing a sex tour of former Soviet countries so yeah he's trying to rebuild what Stalin destroyed he's gonna need a few cars alright um yes so it's hard to imagine a young georgian yeah although stalin is one born at the tail end of the 19th century in the kind of wild west of

15:51the russian empire so right on the frontiers of this huge continental empire he fucks his birth year so he actually says a year later so that he could celebrate his 50th by the time that he'd come to full power in russia right you want a big 50th. Yeah. So it's kind of like African footballer stuff. How much is he, when is he actually born? Anyway, yes, Georgia is, it's Turkish, but it's Kazakhstan. Yes, please. That's kind of where we are. Yeah, okay. Everyone's old. Everyone's top lip can go over their nose. Yeah, their chins touch their foreheads. Exactly. Yeah, the face is imploded. If you're looking at a photo on an iPhone, you just do that and it's Georgian. Right. Their chins touch their foreheads. Exactly, yeah. The face is imploded. If you're looking at a photo on an iPhone,

16:26you just do that and it's Georgian. Right. Now, as you always say, how much should we read into these big figures' childhoods? You know, is it nature or nurture? But... He had a bad dad, so did everyone, pretty much. Well, no, some of us had quite nice dads, actually. No, no, but back then, of course. Some of us had gay dads who ran drama departments, yeah, and really cared about the kids. And look what happened. And look what happens, yeah? They've had a bad son. Yeah. You either get a bad dad or a bad son yeah um uh so he is born nicknamed soso soso um now his mother is deeply religious as everyone i imagine is and his father who we should focus on is called beso and he's a cobbler. Now he is born...

17:05He works at Timpsons. So he's an ex-convict who has got some responsibility and is really getting his life together actually. They're very friendly in Timpsons. But it is a faux pas to ask them how long they served him for what. Yeah, for what? Can you fix my khaki car key also what did you do yeah why are you cutting my keys why are you a cobbler yeah yeah what did you do was it rape or murder come on I want to know who's making my shoes yeah where do you get those tats yeah can I show you your hand so he's born with webbed toes young Stalin right again how important is this yes we don't know we don't know but you could probably do if people were more interested in Stalin like they are so he's born with webbed toes, young Stalin. Right. Again, how important is this? Yes,

17:45we don't know. But you could probably do, if people were more interested in Stalin like they are in Hitler, like this was Hitler, there would be a documentary about how he was because of his webbed toes. His feet. But Stalin does not have as much media about him, to be honest. He doesn't have the same apparent charisma. And this is why I found him initially quite dry and off-putting. Yeah. You're right. There is a lack of charisma, a lack of media mastery a dryness obviously there's a bureaucracy to the communist thing that there isn't you know hitler's gag and pressing it's clock yes part part the other thing about hollywood this is this is maybe a bit more art house you're sort of you have to look for the the narrative within you kind of i don't want to work when i'm watching a film

18:23right i watch a film because i've finished my work yeah so when you're researching dictators you know i don't want to find i don't know work to like the guy yeah i just want to watch a reel of hitler and go i get it i get it i get why they liked him um so uh yeah smallpox at six which leaves him permanently pockmarked and obviously he retouched all his photos so you wouldn't see that he's very short and he's thick set yeah right he's a short king he might even be smaller than napoleon right i think he is because he was five six he's five four he's short and he's boxy so he's uh yeah he's cause cause stuff yeah starlin's dad is probably the most impactful figure in his early life because he basically is an alcoholic who beats the fuck out of them because his cobbler shop uh runs into decline because he's on the

19:09piss he's on well what happens when a rapist cobbler in timpsons when timpsons folds the rapist is just on the streets right and society is actually at risk okay so we must all go to timpsons use it or lose it you must go to timpsons for all your needs otherwise that's how stalin happens this literally a lot of rapists and murderers will be let out onto the streets all go to Timpsons. Use it or lose it. You must go to Timpsons for all your needs. That's how Stalin happened. Literally, a lot of rapists and murderers will be let out onto the streets. Now, two of his sons die and so he turns to alcohol to celebrate, get the champagne out, double miscarriage. I'm so blessed. But his drinking is also exacerbated

19:40by the Zajorjan custom of being paid in wine. Right. Because they love wine but their wine is shit my wine but but their wine is shit though so it's the oldest wine in the world but it's crap as you always say people who invent things they don't know because they never innovate they made the first bottle of wine they go well that's brilliant well done there's no don't tweak it don't fine tune it so I believe Scottish toilets they're still doing it in the ground much like the Scottish are That's brilliant. There's no tweak it. They don't fine tune it. So I believe there's still... Scottish toilets. They're still doing it in the ground, much like the Scottish are. I believe they make sort of cellars.

20:13The way the Indians make bread, they sort of hollow out a bit of thing and slap stuff underneath it. Right. Egg-shaped clay vessels called kvevri. We did it on the wine series. Yeah, traditional. Maybe less traditions, actually. Maybe some more modern sort of well this is what stalin does yeah you know anyway so he beats his wife and his kids does stalin's dad beso he once throws the young stalin down so violently that stalin uh urinates blood for days right um so that's that'll be quite violent where's this coming from though who's saying who's saying this where's this story come from why do we know the town knew him as crazy beso right that's so crazy yeah um and that sounds like he's a bit more of a laugh

20:54crazy beso crazy beso is a good time like bez happy mondays yeah um this is what starlin says in his memoirs that his dad made him this blood for three days this is what also needs to be coloured for his early life because he's mythologized so much he's trying to find the difference between building the great myth of him and the truth so uh basically his dad leaves when Stalin is what six seven something like that uh because uh he assaults a policeman yeah who had been rumored to have be having an affair with his missus and so he flees and now Keke because Georgian people are basically footballers Brazilian footballers is now a single mother she's deeply religious in the orthodox sense this is before she won

21:37the Ballon d'Or sorry it's before Keke won the Ballon d'Or we'll deal with Keke in a separate series part of one of the great Milan teams. She wanted Stalin to become a priest, but Stalin obviously is, you know, he's taking punishment from his dad. He has quite a warped idea of paternal love. So he's a bit of a, he's a bit of a ruffian, a bit of an urchin. You know, he's a sort of a proto gangster. Yeah. So he set fires to, sets fire to he's sort of a proto-gangster yeah so he set fires to set fire to the orchard of a local prince yeah he leads a gang armed with knives and catapults he terrorises shopkeepers by setting off explosives yeah he fires a catapult at a cow which I again he's a laugh

22:19right yeah you know there's also that story that he yeah he crossed a he was trying to impress a girl and he crossed he saw there was trying to impress a girl and he crossed he saw there was like an injured like young deer and he just swam across a river got to it and then broke all its arms and legs and then its neck and then the girl's like it's a bit weird so he was he was developing his tone of voice should have done the neck first yeah I think he just thought it was what did he say check this out calf not its neck just its legs and left it to die yeah oh right so he didn't break his neck it was a calf he said check this out snap snap snap yeah it's a bit weird yeah so he also pushed the younger boy into a river claiming it taught him to swim yeah which which that's very definitive

23:02right that's his view of his own children that's his view of his entire country you definitely you know stalin when he becomes supreme leader views himself as the father of the country and he very much teaches his kids russia into a river yeah and to be fair the way he treats his kids is very similar to the way which there's a consistency we'll be dealing with stalin's children on the poach and fascinating story yeah he pushes the entire russian nation into a river and even though half of it drowns he goes well you can swim now um so uh age 12 he gets hit by a horse and carriage which fucks his arm up yeah so uh this exempts him from military service which is crucial so maybe he would have without this he might have died exactly and he also can't yeah because you were saying

23:38part of the the joy of russian or this period of russian history is that it all is so random yeah and none of it seems predestined. Yeah, this part of history, so much could have happened. There's so many moving parts. There's so much chaos, so much change. It's kind of fascinating who actually managed to grab hold of it. It feels like there's so many moments where it could have completely gone the other way. But yeah, he was injured so he prevented him from dancing properly, but he was also, he had a beautiful singing voice. Do you know that? Really? He had a gorgeous singing voice and he would sing at weddings this young stalin yeah so i think also he when he says it prevented him from dancing properly i can imagine that he maybe in another

24:13world would have been a lovely musical theater musical theater style style of a musical theater yeah wow but the injury put him on a different course so he also was a poet actually yeah not a bad not bad poetry. Well, supposedly. Again, I don't know if the poem is good or not. Our resident poet, the poet laureate of this podcast. Do you want me to read out Mourning by Stalin, Charlie? The pinkish bud has opened, rushing to the pale blue violet and stirred by a light breeze. The lily of the valley has bent over the grass. Flower, oh my Georgia, let peace reign in my native land. Now, because I don't understand subtext, is that a sex thing? No. Bend me over the grass? I don't think so. I think it's a celebration of...

24:58A pink bud opening. It's a nationalist poem about the beauty of the Georgian land and trying to bring peace to it, I believe. But I would like that poem read over images of the famine in ukraine just the kind of you know there's two sides to every man i guess corpse is bent over a grass if you can't handle me at my famine yes you don't deserve me as a poet that's why i don't trust poets um so uh now after the crash uh his dad crazy baser comes back kidnaps him and forces him to work in a shoe factory. So Stalin uses this in his mythology, saying, this is when I first encountered industrial capitalism. Yes, he remembers the heat of the machines and stuff was very influential. The smell of the leather.

25:35Yeah. And working with all the other rapists and Timpsons. Yes. Yes, Charlie? What was your first encounter with industrial capitalism? I worked as a groundsman at the school my mum worked at in the summer holidays, and I fucking loved it. Now, is with industrial capitalism uh i worked as a groundsman at the school my mum worked at in the summer holidays and i fucking loved it now is that industrial capitalism well there was machinery and there was an old guy called ray looked like a raisin which we used to laugh about and we had it was eight till four and there were you'd have two hours of breaks within that uh it was fucking brilliant used to drink tea and watch jeremy kyle and then um yeah and then we'd uh you know poodle about his poor health and safety really kicked off

26:12as well so we'd like bomb about this the big private school and like the back of a trailer and we'd like um fix up the tennis courts the worst job actually this is my this is this is me my experience of styling the shoe factory is there was one a week where there's too many of us working really and so they gave us a job which was getting a dish scouring pad and they had a 50 meter olympic swimming pool in the school and behind the railing was all this scum this algae that built up so not just poor people sorry no yeah they were letting the uh the state school next door use it there's all this scum just lined up at the pool and we had to shoot them all no uh we've got a little dish dish thing and we had to go along the pool scrubbing inside the railing so it really

26:51hurt your knuckles because your hand was basically trapped they could have done it another way but they basically just gave us all something to do because of too many of us well i believe this is sort of what stalin was talking about yeah is that some people have grew up in a shoe factory of rapists yeah and you were sort of gardening at your private school. Yeah, I mean, it's chalk and cheese, really. I think the clearest depiction of it is the pie machine in Chicken Run. Have you seen that? Yes. Where it's like the cold face of machine. I mean, yeah, the story of Mrs. Sweetie's Chicken's Pies is really about farming and stuff like that. And when you're a kid that definitely kind of... So that was your first experience

27:28of industrial capitalism? I'd say so, yeah. Watching a chicken run. Yeah, I mean, to be fair, it's quite a visceral experience for a young child to watch chicken run. Have you had any experience of industrial capitalism? I don't know. I did a work experience... Well, like when I was a kid I was sent to help in a care home where I reorganised this old bookshelf. And care homes were of course a response to industrialization that were made during the so I guess there's that side to it but it's not really cogs in a machine you can chill out mate I'm not a fucking boring woman with blue hair you're trying to finger you're gonna get fingered whether you like it or not yeah I've experienced industrial capitalism

27:57yeah I worked in a care home which is of course a response to industrialization come here you oh disgusting anyway so then his mum sends him to oh no some priests intervene and return him to some sort of seminary but i really think we should i don't care about the seminary russian orthodox who gives a fuck he he's he's trying to be a priest this is a very key part of his life is it yeah because it takes him from being a rural georgian peasant to being educated and it's in this seminary that he uh reads loads and reads all the books that shape his whole life right okay yeah you know like he this is a key part of the story right yeah yeah because he was accepted into priesthood and that's the only way to become

28:38educated that's the only way to sort of move up in the world he was incredibly naturally smart child yeah um and he found these banned books. Hitler was writing banned books. I'll just say that. Okay. You know? Stalin's reading, Hitler's writing. Yeah. The bit I wanted to get to was where, so he's at the seminary reading all this stuff, but the key thing is that he encounters friend of the pod Charles Darwin's theories on evolution. And this is what starts to undermine his faith in the church and pushes him towards Marxism. And this is the other to undermine undermine his faith in the church and pushes him towards marxism and this is the other thing that i think gets left out of the stalin hitler

29:10comparisons is that both stalin and hitler are using warped ideas of science to justify their means what what does how does he use because i thought his darwinism was mainly just a rejection of god it is but in terms of what he finds in Marxism, he thinks Marxism is physics. Right. And that it's like unavoidable. And so all these people are going to die because it's historical physics. It's what's going to happen. Hitler says the same things about biology. Right. But so I guess Marxism teaches you historical process will lead to a dictation of the proletariat. We're just, all of history is leading towards this perfect utopia. I'm just going to fast forward this to get to there. And then Hitler is saying, inevitably, the white race will rule everything because that's

29:55just inevitable progress in history. Exactly. So it's two sides of the same coin. Yeah. It's naughty science. Yeah. So by 1898, he had joined Mesama Dasi who is Georgia's major social democratic man it's a group okay it's not a person yeah this is Borat if it was a drama yes which it is now I think I think they can't he's trying to make allergy again I think everyone's like we want to see Borat's actual story yeah Borat if it's kitchen sink kitchen sink Borat is the start of his life yeah Alan Bennett but it's Borat my wife my Kitchen Sink Kitchen Sink Borat is the start of his life Kitchen Sink yeah Alan Bennett but it's Borat my wife my wife came through the window I'm Ginga the Gas I'm do not curse me

30:32Gypsy but you can't laugh it's trying to laugh to answer it's Borat do not curse me Gypsy please my wife his wife leaves him my wife this is leaves him my wife this is in the Oscar sizzle reel where he's just nominated for best actor my wife such a bad coach there just nodding yeah tear to his eye um so when does he enter the revolutionary underground May 1899 he's only 20 he fucks the seminary off and he becomes a full-time revolutionary now this organisation is illegal because this is the sort of last uh era of the czar yeah so um marxism is gathering speed in russia yeah uh but the czar is still in charge with his okrana the secret police yeah there's many different secret police's through every stage of russian history and they're always

31:18doing the same shit just for whoever's in power uh stalin remains Tiflis, which is in Georgia, and starts working as a meteorologist. What? I don't know who that is. Stalin the weatherman. So what does that mean? What does he... Today, everyone hungry. Right. And this is when he adopts the name Cobra. Cobra is a Georgian folk hero. Is it? Who, I think, he fights back against a corrupt official who rapes someone. And that's why he took that name. Like Robin Hood. Robin Hood for Georgia. Steals from the rich, doesn't give to the poor, just takes it, and the poor starve as well. Yeah. Everyone starves. It's a lovely tale. And May Barron gets raped, probably. Probably. Probably. He says probably.

32:04Probably. I don't know know you work it out by late 1901 stalin uh is in battle me um and uh you know he's starting to get drawn to this figure lenin who's this bald cunt i keep hearing about yeah right who's this andres hiniester sort of figure why is everyone saying he's actually the best you know why why is he he's stealing focus from the front three yeah this is also what i like about sorry about stalin is that because he's not lenin and trotsky right because he's not seen as the big thinker yeah right uh but and yet he's the one that actually enacts communism yeah he's a great doer there's an element of like you know we used to see those meetings of managers and it was like Pep, Klopp, Mourinho, Moresca, Arteta.

32:49Starling's like Sam Allardyce. Yes. He's like, I'll just get rid of it. Yeah. Get the ball, fuck off. Just kill him. Just kill everyone. Yeah. Fuck off, kill him. He is much smarter than he lets on. Well, Big Sam took Bolton into Europe. Oh, okay. But at what cost? Right. How many people had to starve for Big Sam to take Bolton into Europe? Exactly. You know? Look what it did. I guess, yeah. I mean, where are Bolton now? Yeah, he took agrarian Russia into the space age. Yeah, he took Bolton into Europe. In about 20 years. Why is Yuri Dzhokov playing for Bolton, you know? Sam Allardyce is the Stalin of the Premier League. Right, right. Anyway. So Stalin embraces the logic of the worse, the better.

33:28Right. This feels very much key to the story. This is very Russian. The worse, the better. You have to really put yourself in the mind frame. That's on Russian tea towels. That's live, laugh, laugh. Die, hate, wank. Starve, cry, die. Yeah. die hate wank yeah yeah um starve cry die yeah that's russian kitchens yeah that's kitsch in russia starve cry die the worse the better yeah death is love yeah so he starts to favor confrontation of violent tactics is that because of his dad we don't know so he works at an oil refinery uh and uh he he sort of this starts to lay the groundwork for a big strike in 1902 there's a there's a lot i mean there's lots of strikes and people are arrested um anyway stalin avoids the fighting at this big demonstration and escapes

34:16um and he starts to he starts to argue later after the strike the only real power comes out of a long rifle. Bit horny. Yeah. So he's knocking about revolutionary circles. They're now watching him closely. He's arrested in 1902, sent to Siberia, and this is where we get the iconic headshot, probably the most attractive headshot of a dictator, certainly until Saddam. You've got to remember he's 5'4", though. I just want people to bring that in like everyone's fucking you're getting a lot of middle class mums saying oh you know I can have a little piece of style you have to remember he's now when you see that you're like is this a guy he's wearing a fucking free Palestine rally thing I know but is this

34:57the kind of guy who's pinching bums in the Italian Mediterranean city do you know what I mean a 5 foot 4 little guy please yeah exactly he looks like Zayn Malik X Factor I want to say what four little guy please yeah exactly yeah he looks like Zayn Malik x-factor I want to say what was that x-factor year where he had the fucking can we get Zayn Malik up uh with what would you even call this oh that's real rapist stuff that's Russell Brand stuff yeah that's a rapist scarf they're very similar sort of vibes what could have been yeah like that is young Stalin look look at that one yeah right what happened to zayn malik what happened to him is he was he in one direction yeah he was the first one

35:30to split off he was sort of hoping to have a rob williams-esque split off but it didn't really work out for him he's got a great voice though zayn um like starlin much like starlin much like starlin um and he's also if his arm didn't get injured so that he could dance. Right. So there's the hot photo. Anyway, he's in exile in Siberia. And there's a common theme here that he keeps getting sent to Siberia. He gets exiled nine times and escapes eight. Yeah, it's pretty good. So he prefers drinking with the petty criminals rather than the actual political exiles because he's a guy. He's a bloke. This is why I like him. He's hearing people talk about theory. It's like, fuck off. There's no annoying women here to finger.

36:15I don't need this. I just want to hang out with the guys. Where are those Timpson rapists like my dad? Let's hang out with them. I want to hang out with them. If it's talking to the boring blue-haired lot about fucking art house cinema or the timpson i mean the timpson guys lived alive on hillways what's he done yeah why are you cobbling my shoes i want to hear your story brother yeah he went down for armed robbery you know um anyway so uh he's he's uh he tries the first escape attempt he basically doesn't even fucking have a coat and it's Siberia in winter this is where you start the dramatic film right you have this this frostbitten Stalin walking 50 miles and then realising that he's gonna die

36:54if he keeps going I forgot the mic out well I feel that takes out of the the drama so that's the shot it's him walking in the Tundra and then the camera pans in I left my coat and he turns around and walks back and people go oh well I was thinking it was more like the opening to There Will Be Blood where you're sort of to see you know the drama of him as a character but yeah I like the kind of the slow build you're hearing the wind blowing and then I forgot my coat he looks down the barrel of the camera hearing the wind blowing and then it I forgot my card he looks down the barrel at the camera I left my card and then he goes Stalin title credits and then he walks back anyway so he travels 50 miles

37:39of the 4,000 mile journey before turning back but this it does sum up everything you need to know about Stalin this story. He's a doer. I mean, that 50 miles in the freezing cold with just half a loaf of bread and a thin coat is pretty nuts. Yeah. So, um... And that's why he doesn't mind sending people to their death so much, because he's like, well... Well, I escaped. Yeah. Pulled himself up. Right. So we need to get to him meeting Lenin. So by 1904, he's managed to blag his way back to Georgia from exile from exile yeah in december 1905 at a conference in finland these two huge figures meet for the first time and they're both a bit disappointed in the other one yes because stalin's been hearing about this guy yes and he's like like he's this new jesus sort of figure yeah and he's

38:20a bit like yeah because he does look like a bank clerk. Hello. Yeah, he looks like he works at NatWest. I'm Lenin. Fuck. Yeah. But Lenin, supposedly, when he meets him again, 18 months later, has completely forgotten his name. Yeah. So they're both kind of not that. He was described as like a grey blur. Like he was just incredibly forgettable with a thick Georgian accent. He doesn't really fit in with the Russian intellectual class. Now, but he starts becoming more useful to Lenin and the Bolsheviks because the Bolsheviks are funding themselves through basically armed robberies. And Stalin is essentially a crook. Lenin starts to value Stalin's willingness to do this violent nitty-gritty. So there's a big thing which we talked about

39:01in the Russian Revolution series called the Tiflis bank robbery which is an insane i mean it's like a main square in the capital of georgia almost or one of the one of the big cities 1907 a huge coach carrying money to the state bank is attacked with guns and homemade bombs 40 are killed 40 people that's a lot of people yeah i mean you know you don't even get 40 people in a terrorist attack of people yeah I mean you know you don't even get 40 people in a terrorist attack nowadays no these days Prius Promenade when I was growing up that would be every other week 6-7 at most yeah call that a terrorist attack they put the bollards up in the Christmas markets and now it's like 2 or 3 2 or 3 max

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41:44Done. on Carvana. Just put in your vehicle information and we'll give you an offer. Done, no hassle, no negotiation, no guy from an online listing low-balling you. Which means by the time I'm done explaining this, you could have basically done it. Still haven't started? Hey, better late than never. Sell your car today on Carvana. Pickup fees may apply uh they escape with the equivalent of nearly four and a half million pounds in today's money uh so he then goes to baku in azerbaijan yeah um and his gang continues to fund bolshevism through the rackets the robbery kidnapping brothels uh he's arrested again in baku into exile and then escapes again this is a constant pattern now in 1912 he starts to use stalin man of steel so steel is stalin so elliot stalin

42:33our friend the comedian elliot stalin mark stalin is done they're both lefties who have like or radio four yes so it does it's fine for you to say oh oh, Mark Stalin's back on the Radio 4. Stalinism continues. Spreading his trot bollocks. Yes, yeah. The Stalinist capture of Radio 4 continues. Of course, Mark Stalin, Elliot Stalin. So 1912 is when he becomes Stalin. Should we place 1912 for the listeners? 1912 is, well, do we know the exact month of 1912 is well do we know the exact month 1912 that he starts calling himself Stalin because obviously the Titanic sinks in April 1912 yes I was going to say the Titanic it's just before so is it after the Titanic and it's before the suffragettes were jaijitsu-ing

43:20police officers yes with wedding cakes on their heads I was going to say it's after Franz Reichelt. Oh, right. And before Liam Payne. Was he the right one? Was that the right one? Yes. Yeah. So they're both two attempts to fly. Yeah. Yeah. And Liam Payne forgot his big trousers. Yeah. I think. I don't really remember the ins and outs of the case, but I think he forgot to put his big trousers on. Big One Direction episode, this. Yeah. I think. I don't really remember the ins and outs of the case, but I think he forgot to put his big trousers on. Big One Direction episode, this. Huge. Yeah. So, now, a key moment in the Stalin story is February 1913. He's in St. Petersburg looking for an underground base

43:56and he has this contact called Roman Malinovsky, who's a Bolshevik leader. However, he's secretly one of the Ekraner's agents and Malinovsky invites Stalin to attend a fundraising dinner, which is a trap and he's arrested one of the Akhrana's agents. And Malinowski invites Stalin to attend a fundraising dinner, which is a trap, and he's arrested. And this betrayal stays with Stalin, who will become one of the most paranoid men ever. Yes. Throughout the story, this betrayal stays with Stalin. It's hard to know which of the many betrayals. My dad beat me so hard. Exactly. Everyone tries, in any story, they always try and pin it on something. I think it's the, just every week of his life, someone betraying him

44:28is probably the, where the paranoia comes from. So he's exiled for four years to, again, is this the ninth time he's been exiled then? Which is, this is, now this is near the Arctic Circle. Because this is his last exile. This is 1914. Yeah. So he is, he kind of dodges World War I, partly through exile, but also I think he's medically unfit to serve. Yeah. So again, it's like a, you know, the serendipity of it. Yeah. So he remains there until the Tsarist regime collapse. But he was like, this is right in the Arctic Circle, who's in a hut for weeks on his own, circled with wolves. Yeah. And apparently Churchill was talking to him about the split up of Europe and Stalin wasn't listening. He was just drawing a big wolf.

45:11Yeah. So it's clearly, you know, he loves wolves. I think the wolves that represent the fear and paranoia is what I was going to go for. Oh, right. He loves, you know, I guess he loves wolves. That's a, that's a better read on that. You know, as I say again, I'm not a libtard. You're trying to finger. So he loves wolves he loves wolves i don't like subtext stalin draws wolves he likes wolves next he doesn't view his political opponents as wolves circling his heart no he loves no he just likes wolves that's why he's drawing wolves. He's a simple man, yeah? He loves wolves. Take anything away from this episode, listeners, is that Stalin fucking loved a wolf. He did. He loved them. You know? Because they're a bit like dogs.

45:59Yes, but bigger and scarier. Bigger and fluffier. Yeah. So, in March 1917, the czar has fallen and stalin travels to petrograd and expects a welcome at the station but he doesn't get one and this is the key moment this is the key moment and this is why he spends it he spends this is a very sad moment he's expecting you know it's your mum not picking you up from school and it stays with you. My mum got picked up late by my grandma. She still brings up, she was six years old. It's a defining memory. It's like, you know, this sort of, this is key and he's expecting his mates to be there and no one's there. He stood up. He gets off the train. Where's my friend? I guess not. That's the second scene in the film.

46:46I forgot my friend. Oh, no. Yeah. He gets back on the train. I do like a Stalin biopic where everything's serious apart from his voice. So everything's just filming crudely, dramatically. Oh, no, my wife. My God. People are starving. Oh, you're hungry. Get some more bread. I am king of the castle. This is what he gets. Look at're hungry king of the castle look at me king in the castle yeah now lenin later gets a huge revolutionary welcome yeah very famous so and this again is starting to set a bit of a grudge the paranoia the the self-pity i suppose now this is a really he's he's to be fair to him he doesn't let the self-pity come out and bitterness he's a he's a watcher because he's the ultimate he's the be fair to him he doesn't let the self pity come out in bitterness

47:25he's a he's a watcher because he's the ultimate he's the Tom Wamsgam of this story right at this point he is he realises being underestimated is his key asset totally because everyone's doing people like Trotsky are doing such flowery speeches they're making such a big show wanker you're pfff but yeah no carry on sorry no no no we should just recap we have a five parter on the Russian Revolution which which we recommend downing before you get onto this but you have these three central figures you have Lenin Stalin Trotsky and Trotsky as you say is in the shadows Wombsgamming it yes right whereas Lenin's the big brain yeah what's interesting about all three of those figures they're all very intelligent

48:11but they're also all men of action to be fair to them as much as there's a lot of flowery language Trotsky in the civil war is a great military commander they've all got different skill sets but Trotsky is like a was like a freak prodigy genius so he was born into a Ukrainian farming family with 12 siblings and he was just like a freak prodigy genius. So he was born into a Ukrainian farming family with 12 siblings. And he was just like a freak genius. So he doesn't respect anyone he speaks to. Punchable face. He looks down on everyone. What? My liege. He's my liege. He also looks down on everyone. What's the matter, Lager boy? Afraid you might taste something? Yes. He drinks a lot of craft.

48:46He's a hobgoblin. Oh, he's a fucking hobgoblin, this guy. The size of his head, the pince-nez, and the most annoying beard ever. And it's his fatal flaw is what eventually means that he doesn't take power is because he's such a hobgoblin. He's so annoying. He calls everyone that could have been his ally a lager boy. Yeah. And that was the problem. And that's the tragic flaw of most hobgoblins. They don't have anyone to drink hobgoblins with because they think everyone else is a lager boy. So they just drink it by themselves. Yeah. Yeah. Some of us like lager. Lager's great. Lager boys hang out as well. Yeah, because they're with the boys. Lager is social. The hobgoblin. Hobgoblins is antisocial.

49:24Right? Yeah. Solitary creatures, the hobgoblin Hobgoblins is anti-social right yeah solitary creatures the Hobgoblins yeah so Trotsky and Stalin's a Lager boy to be honest this is why I like him alright this is why I don't like Trotsky this is why I like the more I hear about Stalin the more I like him because you know relative to the other communist people in their story he's my favourite he's the Lager boy in a room full of Hobgoblins yeah he is so trotsky's a cosmopolitan intellectual right um uh i don't think there's anyone i've wanted to punch in the face more yeah alive or dead yeah um yeah so he looks like me so trotsky thinks stalin is a bureaucratic mediocrity calls him comrade index card

50:05right savage wit from Trotsky yeah I bet he says that and he turns to some girls and is like yeah comrade index card over there yeah but Stalin now when does is Stalin general secretary at this point no he's not so they take power right the three of them and then World War I ends. And listen, the Russian Civil War is insane. Yeah, it's just... We can't really... Civil Wars are always horrific and bleak, but the Russian ones, it's tenfold. Also, the different things that happen. I mean, interestingly, Churchill and the Brits are fighting with the... Is it the whites? The whites, yeah. Against the Reds. Their funding. Yeah. So in many ways, it's a continuation of world war one in some regard anyway stalin and trotsky the

50:50real story the the critical one is that stalin and trotsky are rivals during the civil war and that intensifies because trotsky commands the red army he helps yeah yeah that's what they would say yeah and um have you got that yeah have you seen that right no louis van hal's red army look at this so this is louis van hal who's got quite an unfortunate dutch sort of guttural accent this is him one of the weakest chins in football yes one of the weakest chins in football and that's probably where the guttural noises come from is it look at this so this is him trying to fit in with the new fan base and it just comes out a bit strong that one so this is trotsky uh in with the new fan base and it just comes out a bit strong, that one.

51:25So this is Trotsky, geeing people up with his oratory skills. Louis van Gaal's Red Army. Come on Louis, can we have one from you? Louis van Gaal's Red Army. Yeah. Louis van Gaal's Red Army. Yeah, the Dutch and the lack of chin really. Louis van Gaal's Red Army. But I imagine that's what trotsky's saying because he's so like yeah people say he's electrifying public speaker but he's like fuck it all that guy who's brought that guy why is he in charge anyway stalin does not trust the former czarist officers that trotsky wants to use to help command the red army so uh So what Stalin does is that he's in Tsaritsyn, which has then become Stalingrad. He arrests the former Tsarists without trial using the Cheka,

52:10which is the name of the new Okhrana secret police. And so 400 Tsarist officers are imprisoned on a barge in the Volga with one toilet, and they eventually, they all starve or get executed. Right. Which is a blessing if they all had one toilet. One toilet between 400. It's like Charlie's house. Well, Charlie doesn't need the toilet, so he'd be fine. And they eventually, they all starve or get executed. Right. Which is a blessing if they all had one toilet. One toilet between 400. It's like Charlie's house. Well, Charlie doesn't need the toilet, so he'd be fine. He just chucks out the window, doesn't he? Anyway. So Trotsky becomes furious, demands Stalin gets removed, blah, blah, blah. He complains about Trotsky.

52:40Trotsky and Stalin are bickering to Lenin, right? And eventually Stalin gets recalled. There's a bit about the polish campaign in 1920 when uh they're basically both arguing over whether to um attack or to withdraw i'll just say during the war stalin knocks a lot of people off his what he's good at is organizing a power structure that is unified and with one head yeah so he in this in the civil war he's obsessed with killing people basically. Yeah. Which is his management style. A management style. Well, yes, it's a robust management style. You say, you know, everyone has to handle HR differently. Stalin does it very robustly. So the key moment is in April 22, he becomes the general secretary

53:21of the communist party. Now this is because Lenin is starting to get a bit ill. Yeah. The civil war has been won. It's the roaring 20s.'s the 20s not in russia it's not um so lenin is like the day-to-day stuff lenin can't do anymore yeah right uh so stalin does this and what he this is when he really wombs gams it yeah because he realizes that many people think this role is a bit boring but he's like i control the appointments i control who i uh appoint two roles i could control who's in the room and so suddenly he builds this fleet of people who owe their careers to him and so he's starting to inspire loyalty and also he speaks in plain language yeah whereas the other cunts are all fucking blah, you know,

54:05dialectical materialism of the, fuck off, just speak normally. You know what I mean? This is so clearly coming from personal experiences of you in a kitchen in Bristol. Yeah, there's one person I'm thinking about who I'm still friends with and I try and avoid talking to politics about it because it's just fucking, stop using shit words, it's a party. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, I have written a book anyway um in may 1922 weeks after becoming general secretary lenin has a stroke and he is paralyzed and he can't really speak and then a second stroke hits him in december there's a second stroke and um st Stalin becomes suddenly Lenin's link to the outside world. Can we get a photo up of Stalin and Lenin when he's ill?

54:49So Stalin's- Lenin's like in Breaking Bad, the guy who's flicking the bell. Totally. And when he's seeing that Stalin's going to take over, he's like- So can I just say that that face is what Georgians look like. Tell me. Yeah. So this is, yeah, that's Stalin in the chair now there's a moment where Lenin's wife Nadezhda Krupskaya yeah is passing Stalin information yes no is passing Lenin information and so Stalin regards this as interference because the medical team had said don't he can't work he's fucked and so he confronts her by telephone in 1922 and then work he's fucked and so he confronts her by telephone in 1922 and then and he's horrible to her he's really but he's a bloke he's really

55:31he's shit love but you don't no but you don't mean someone else's wife like that he's a winding neck in love would you right he's fucked he doesn't need this he doesn't need you going at him as well he's just taken power yeah and you're having a go at him he talks about you know Lennon shagging other birds it's a lot it's a lot so then lenin then turns against stalin because um you know he's whipped by his wife and so uh they all get to a head when in on the 5th of march 1923 he dictates one of his final letters to stalin demanding that he apologize to kripskaya or he'll break everything off with him. You have been so rude as to summon my wife to the telephone and use bad language. Ah, come on.

56:11It goes without saying that what has been done against my wife I consider having been done against me as well. I ask you therefore to think it over whether you are prepared to withdraw what you've said and to make your apologies or whether you prefer that relations between us should be broken off. Damn. So basically, Stalin's just sworn at his wife down the phone and Lenin won't have it. And then he does's just sworn at his wife down the phone. Yeah. And Lenin won't have it. And then he does the most passive-aggressive apology ever. I'm sorry if she took offence. Yeah, I'm sorry that you feel that way is what he says, basically. I was just saying like it is. I'm a straight shooter, right? Your wife can't handle it.

56:36Yeah. Right? Sorry that I'm a laugh. Yeah. No, I genuinely have used that excuse before. Really? Yeah. When you get told off for the way you speak to amanda's friends yeah yeah there's one moment your husband's cheating on you no i made it i made it i made a joke i made a joke about a friend of amanda's love life and then um to her to her face yeah i won't go into the details but then it turned but then she went and cried and then amanda had a go at me and i was like well i'm sorry your friend's not alive. I genuinely said that. It was after our Shepherds Bush show. Were you sorry? No. So you weren't sorry that her friend's not alive? Oh, yeah. I'm sorry her friend's not alive. That's what I'm sorry for, right?

57:13I'm sorry for you. I'm sorry a girl would be able to take that joke. Yeah, I am sorry. It's heartbreaking. Yeah. Right? It's one of the saddest stories I've ever heard. I'm sorry that one of your oldest friends can't take a fucking joke. Anyway, not to bring domestic matters into the podcast, but it's an argument that has quite a long tail. Anyway, what is it, Charlie? Have you ever had to give anyone a telling off for being rude to Amanda? No, Amanda can handle herself. Yeah. She can handle it. She can more than handle herself. If anything, I've got to apologise to people for what Amanda said and the accent in which she said it quite often Amanda we're at the school gates please yeah would you leave your

57:54alter egos at home I'm not even joking so Lennon has a huge stroke on the 10th of March and this is is this his final stroke pretty much four fourth stroke takes him out and he dies of a cerebral hemorrhage on the 21th of March and this is is this his final stroke? Yeah. Pretty much. Four fourth stroke takes him out and he dies of a cerebral hemorrhage on the 21st of January 1924. He's only 53. Damn. Now by this point Stalin has been writing Lenin's been writing letters saying not Stalin needs to fuck off he's too crass and he's rude and it's not a cerebral hemorrhoid Charlie it's not piles in the head he's not got head piles. In a way Go on. In's not piles on the head. It's not got head piles.

58:26In a way. Go on. In a way, that's what I heard. You look like you've got head piles. Because of this mask. Fucking hat. Yeah. So now, this is key. Now, Stalin is general secretary. It's his job to arrange the fucking funeral, right? So now Lenin- The key thing, this whole story is such a good lesson in how to take power you've got all the checklists yeah right one of the key things you need to be in charge of organizing the previous leader's funeral that's like that gives you so much control it does isn't it yeah of course you know and so the lenin's missus is like plumey bury him stalin's no like i'm gonna embalm him yeah and as we've always said we're a huge embalming we hope and again one of the reasons i like starlin he's like i'm

59:11gonna force the issue we're having him embalmed that's the end of it yeah put my foot down we're embalming him yeah right so um he also tells trotsky that the funeral's uh another day which is the key moment because trotsky's his key um rival oh yeah it's all saturday mate yeah yeah it's not just it's not just that yeah it's better than that he tells trotsky that you're really struggling with your mental health he says you're stressed he says on me don't worry about it i'm gonna pay for a two-week hunting trip in siberia so that you can relax just take it put your feet up and then not only is lenin's funeral happening while he's doing it but everyone's like well Trotsky doesn't give a fuck he's on holiday

59:47awesome perfect someone's like yeah I told them the funeral was today yeah alright for some fucking hell so now he still hasn't fully consolidated power because there's so many bureaucrats this is what I find a bit dizzying and a bit it's off-putting a lot of this stuff it becomes a troika which is a three-person leadership with him zinonev zinoviev and kamenev yeah so those three are a troika in charge as an interim sort of for the next four or five years the key thing to say is that just before lenin dies he starts to take the foot off the gas of the collectivization and industrialization saying we can't force socialism on, he starts to take the foot off the gas of the collectivization and industrialization

1:00:26saying we can't force socialism on this. We have to take our time. So what Stalin does- Which gives a flavor of what his leadership might have been like. Yeah. What Stalin does, I think, is that he first defeats the left of the party or is it the right? I mean, he's the left of the party, to be honest. No, but there's someone... The people who... Fuck it, I can't remember who it is. There's moderates. Basically, he defeats the people who were against... who were saying London wasn't moving fast enough. He quashes them. And then what he does is that he takes their arguments and use them to quash Booker in, who is on the right of the party. And so he basically uses the left to defeat the right,

1:01:07then the right to defeat the left, whatever. So that by 1929, essentially the two big players are Stalin and Trotsky, and Trotsky is exiled to Kazakhstan in 1928. So he then will settle in Mexico and Trotsky will continue to publish books criticising Stalin. Because Trotsky's a celebrity. He's got international acclaim. He was much more involved in the revolution, the civil war, but he's pissed everyone off. People like Stalin because Stalin's kept his mouth shut and they don't know what's hiding underneath Stalin. But Trotsky, apparently a lot of closest friends of Trotsky says, says reflectively he never asked me a question about me once yeah in my whole life so these are all lessons about uh how to take power stalin who i would not say is

1:01:56like a exactly like the most loving guy he remembered people's birthdays he like sorted people out with fixing their fridges and stuff where they got new apartments in moscow yeah like he just little details like that don't worry about that so you know that Stalin's a nice guy isn't he he didn't have to do any of that there's genuinely a lot of life lessons about getting power in any field from these guys people say that when Trotsky spoke in meetings they could understand every third word yeah where Stalin he was also branding it he was he's got a Russell Brand-esque he definitely does yeah but what do you mean though what does stop mean in a metaphysical sense you know what when you say stop having sex with me what are you actually saying in the grand

1:02:33scheme of the great scheme of things you know yes no what are these words just linguistic ways of us understanding the cosmos by 1929 stalin has seized power okay it is one of the most extraordinary seizures of power. I think we've seen... You know, other dictators, they don't have to work for it quite like Stalin does. And it's so methodical. And it's over such a long period of time. He seizes power through admin. It's remarkable. He is the head of... He's basically done a coup within a coup. And he now has more people under his control than probably anyone else in Europe at this point. So we're going to end this episode here. In the next episode, how will he use that power? Yeah. Five-year plans.

1:03:13Ladies, we're going to talk about agriculture. Okay? You may want to duck out from the next episode until you've got a new pair of pants. Don't eat either because it's going to be a hungry one. It's a hungry episode. Next one. Yeah. The entirety of this four part Stalin series is on the Patreon where we'll also be doing episodes on Stalin's children and friend of the pod a good man Beria who's maybe one of the great rapists of all time great in the sense of capital G capital R great rapist of all time the great that's on the Patreon Great is the wrong word. Great in the sense of... Capital G, capital R. Great rapist of all time. Yeah. Groat. The groat. The grapist. That's on the Patreon for those who subscribe

1:03:50where we are bigger than Hamas. We are bigger than ISIS. Charlie, how big is Hezbollah? You know, we're not yet at the Taliban. How big is Hezbollah? 50,000. Fuck. Bigger than Hezbollah. Take that. Yeah. Take that, Hamas. Take that, ISIS. They are recruiting. Bigger than Hezbollah. Bigger than Hezbollah. Take that. Yeah. Take that, Hamas. Take that, ISIS. They are recruiting because they know that we're growing so big. Yeah. So now all of these, you know, Iranian proxy forces are recruiting. Next episode, we'll deal with the hungry stuff and subscribe to the Patreon to get all of it now. From all of us here at FinVest History, Yeah. Yeah. When you spend enough time around great companies, you notice that the best ones treat trust as a growth strategy,

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