Why did Robert Moses change from an idealist to a ruthless builder, according to Robert Caro?

Robert Caro says the young Moses was a genuine idealist who worked on civil-service reform and wanted to open Long Island beaches to city people. After early failures, Moses learned to find and use people's weaknesses, and power hardened him against any opposition. By the Cross Bronx Expressway he would evict tens of thousands rather than move the route. Caro says the one question he would ask Moses is whether he realised he was changing, and doubts that he did.

• Bronx politician Henry Epstein proposed shifting the expressway two blocks south to evict a couple of hundred people instead; Caro says Moses set out to destroy him.
• Caro interviewed Moses seven times; after Caro raised a donation tied to a spared golf course, Moses stopped talking to him.
• Caro said the expressway became a huge traffic jam as soon as it opened.

Source: our own transcription of the episode. The full conversation is on Dwarkesh Podcast (2026-10-30). Read the whole episode summary →

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