Answered from Thomas More's Utopia · In Our Time · 2026-10-15
Joanne Paul explains that nothing is private anywhere on More's island, and its customs are designed to strip value from what 16th-century England prized. Gold is used for chamber pots and slaves' chains, and gemstones are children's toys that adults throw away so as not to look childish. Paul reads the gold chains as a jab at court service, the same chain More wears in Holbein's famous portrait.
“they use gold as chamber pots so toilets and they use gold as slave chains” Joanne Paul · at 20:53 — open in the transcript →
Source: our own transcription of the episode. The full conversation is on In Our Time (2026-10-15). Read the whole episode summary →